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Political Stuff

Discussion in 'Social Discussion' started by electrolyte, Sep 26, 2016.

  1. jklmnop

    jklmnop
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    data sanitation engineer

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    There's a ton of stuff to unpack wrt the connections between race/ethnicity, education, national origin/immigration policy, but maybe most importantly, the commonality of economic CLASS. We all do a piss poor job of talking about class, even though the VAST majority of us have it in common (esp with rising income inequality). Political elites of every stripe want to ignore and want the people themselves to ignore economic class distinctions because it serves THEM waaaaaaay more than US when people of the same economic class start dividing and demonizing each other over race, origin, orientation, gender, etc.

    Since you brought up mass incarceration, have you seen the film 13th? It's still on Netflix (and probably lots of other places...). It's been a few months now since I've watched it, but it occurred to me that you might gain something from watching it, even w/ its occasional bluster and too many preening talking heads IMO.

    IIRC, among other things it is a damning indictment of the failures of the prison system, and the privatization and profiting off of populations in crisis esp. since the Clinton-era decisions that doomed a generation of Americans. (Yes, both Bill and Hillary Clinton are castigated in this film, and rightly so.) It's a wide-ranging exploration of systems of oppression in this country that goes beyond race towards the ways in which power USES race as a tool to divide people and maintain power. I found it to be eye-opening, if also occasionally too far-reaching and OTT. It provides context for the economic distress African American communities face, and shows how people of color are used by those in power to control what people think and feel about each other through stereotyping and demonization. This quote came to mind wrt all this

    "If you can convince the lowest white man he's better than the best colored man, he won't notice you're picking his pocket. Hell, give him somebody to look down on, and he'll empty his pockets for you." (LBJ)

    ---

    edit to add: I still had the Snopes tab open so I clicked through to the full Bill Moyers LBJ quote and bkgd and it's actually a fascinating read:

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/arch...as-like/d483c1be-d0da-43b7-bde6-04e10106ff6c/
    from 1988, there's another prescient quote in here, you'll know it when you see it
     
    #2661 jklmnop, Feb 8, 2018
    Last edited: Feb 8, 2018
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  2. jan

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  3. DCI

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    So apparently the president isn't going to declassify that Democratic memo after all. I guess that whole sunlight is the best disinfectant thing didn't last too long.
     
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  4. CanadianPleco

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    Sorry connoisseur

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  5. PolarBearDog

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    Maybe we should wait for them to correct it first...
    Ohh I guess now the whole "danger to national security" shtick didn't last too long, did it? :thinking:
    [​IMG]
     
  6. PolarBearDog

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    They are. It's an ongoing process.
    That's because the Department of Justice limited the number of people who were allowed to view them. From the Department itself:

    Wow, is this a subtle way of saying I'm stupid? :thinking:
     
  7. PolarBearDog

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  8. DCI

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    The reason given for the Democratic memo not being released when the Republican one was is that it had to go through a scrubbing process first. It was then unanimously voted to be released by the house intel committee, followed by it sitting at the white house all week where anything that needed to be redacted could have been. They didn't actually do anything though, other than wait until the last minute and then send it back.

    It was just a week ago that allies of the president in the house, most of whom had seen both memos, were justifying ignoring the warnings of the FBI and DOJ wrt to the Republican memo by saying that they owed it to the public to get everything out in the open ASAP. Iirc you were saying the same thing. Then when the president does the opposite of that, everyone spins on a dime to defend it.

    I didn't want either memo to be released, and I'd actually be totally fine with the Democratic memo never seeing the light of day, even if it's obviously for all the wrong reasons. This isn't something that's even been investigated by the intel committee. They didn't talk to any of the FISA judges or DOJ/FBI officials involved, and actually rejected offers to be briefed by the FBI director. The idea that somehow it's proper oversight to then make public top secret memos that are basically partisan hot takes based on incomplete information is ridiculous, especially when those documents are then being sent to the White House, where there are people under investigation that could potentially benefit from it. Devon Nunes probably did more to hurt his own arguments than the Democratic memo would anyway by making it clear that the FISA warrant in question was issued a month after Carter Page left the Trump campaign and several months after the Russia probe was opened as the result of a tip from Australian officials, as well as admitting that the judges were actually informed that some of the intelligence presented to them was from politically motivated sources.

    I wasn't trying to say that you're stupid. I just think that this whole thing is insulting to the intelligence of the public. I mean, there were fairly high profile people that were running around saying this was going to be bigger than Watergate. I don't think that you're stupid, but I also don't think you actually believe that this memo business isn't political.
     
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  9. Horse Feathers

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    There's no future in time travel.

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    Adding another irony and hypocrisy to the pile. The comments take care of it. Sorry Combover Caligula, you don't get to have it both ways ;)

     
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  10. iDoseDMT

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    I may or may not be here

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  11. Horse Feathers

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    There's no future in time travel.

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    I'm happy when middle class people get a tax break. I say that before I get the obligatory "why don't you donate your refund to a charity". Not happy about the Koch brothers and their offspring getting the bulk of it at the expense of Medicare and Social Security to which I've paid into for 42 years now.

     
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  12. jklmnop

    jklmnop
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    data sanitation engineer

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    Yesterday's Pod Save America had an extended riff on this guy.
     
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  13. jklmnop

    jklmnop
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    data sanitation engineer

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    Things we could have paid for instead of the tax cut scam:

    - comprehensive student loan forgiveness estimated at 1.4 T for all borrowers (talk about an economic stimulus!)
    - replacement of crumbling bridges, roads, airports, municipal buildings (tons of new jobs)
    - a sustained effort to save lives and recover from the opoid crisis (new jobs, new facilities, a healing of broken communities and more stringent regs and penalties on big pharma)
    - new WPA-style program to put people to work both on infrastructure and cultural programs to improve our communities (jobs and overall improvement in quality of life for everyone)
    - funding a nationwide education and job training plan/moonshot to better prepare the populace for automation and AI revolution (cheaper than the alternative of civil unrest/UBI/extreme poverty)

    But instead, Wyatt Koch and his ilk get new toys they could already afford before. Thanks GOP!
     
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  14. jan

    jan
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    and meanwhile, trump has not asked the fbi to protect this country from election interference. Incompetence? Treason?
     
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  15. jan

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    OMG Florida! :(
    So many kids dead.
     
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  16. PeachyRider

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    Real Southern Comfort

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    damn tragic. can't imagine being one of the parents
     
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  17. Brocktoon

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    Hey man, you fuckin' know Belvedere?

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    17 confirmed.

    Apparently this is the 18th school shooting of 2018. And it's February 14th...
     
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  18. jan

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    If he planned it, he knew it was Valentine's Day:cry:
     
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  19. jan

    jan
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